Chev
Junior Member
Struggling to learn and grow.
Posts: 97 
Pronouns: She/Her
Religion: Oh, ain't that the question
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Post by Chev on Jan 27, 2015 14:42:32 GMT -6
So, while I have Manannan... being himself, I've also been a bit of a fangirl about another for quite a while now. Väinämöinen. I was wondering exactly how bad it would be to consider (and potentially act upon) giving trinkets/thanks to him? Are there particular religions you just don't cross like that? Or is it generally a bad idea to consider mixing like that? I'm also a bit fangirly for Math, too... That's a third one right there, but I could probably just do best with reading his stories. Would that be the best thing to do in general when you have such an appreciation for large figures of other religions? I'm sure there are some you just don't mix, like Celtic mythos and Egyptian mythos (I see the Egyptian pantheon [Kemetic mythos? Kemetic pantheon?] as the stern parents with an exception to Bast), but I really don't know how that all works =\
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Post by wyrdwanderings on Jan 27, 2015 14:55:32 GMT -6
I am personally quite fond of Väinämöinen and Ukko, so you are not alone in that feeling.
I am of the opinion that a healthy amount of respect and admiration is a good thing, and if you wanted to expand your own knowledge of them and perhaps more, I don't see why not. Reading is a good starting place, and so is understanding them better. Work up to the point of the approach, perhaps?
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druvian
Newbie
Posts: 6
Pronouns: She/her
Religion: Kemetic
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Post by druvian on Jan 27, 2015 14:56:44 GMT -6
I think that's funny because I see the Celtic pantheon as being the stern ones and the Kemetic as being really chill.  [EDIT: yes I'm sure they're lovely, I just thought it was funny that their impression was the exact opposite of mine. x3 no offense meant] If none of the religions are closed and the deities in question don't mind I don't know why you couldn't mix pantheons or venerate deities from other pantheons...for religions not crossing the closest I've seen is that the Greek pantheon don't like to be put second to those in another pantheon. I don't know of any (open) religions you can't mix, really. Sometimes specific deities don't like you having anything to do with other deities/pantheons, but that doesn't mean it can't be done. In history, iirc, people would venerate the deities of the area when passing through just out of respect. |
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Post by brimstonne on Jan 27, 2015 15:19:04 GMT -6
Hey hey were not stern...just have a LOT of homework involved in our religion haha. The only thing about worshiping deities from multiple pantheons is to honor each in the separate ways of their culture. From what I understand Väinämöinen is a Finnish deity, from what I have been told is not a closed culture, so worshiping/honoring is okay. But I would definitely read into things first, learn everything you can, and that way nothing offensive would be done. With Math, Im assuming you mean Math fab Mathonwy, who is really a fascinating deity, who is also from an open religion, so it is okay to honor him. But he is Brythonic, not Gaelic like Lugh, so there are some differences in how he should be approached. So again, research research RESEARCH. And try not to mix cultures or ways to honor them, and be respectful of their cultures.
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Post by brimstonne on Jan 27, 2015 15:22:59 GMT -6
I am personally quite fond of Väinämöinen and Ukko, so you are not alone in that feeling. I am of the opinion that a healthy amount of respect and admiration is a good thing, and if you wanted to expand your own knowledge of them and perhaps more, I don't see why not. Reading is a good starting place, and so is understanding them better. Work up to the point of the approach, perhaps? ^^^THIS THIS THIS Probably one of the most common things you will hear me say on this board is to start out by reading. Read everything you can get your hands on. Act like a fangirl with a brand new fanfiction website and read as much as you possibly can before deciding on anything. There is no such thing as too much knowledge. Now Im not saying you have to read everything in one night or anything. It took me almost a year of research before I prayed to the Morrigan, or offered her anything, and that was with her in the background basically screaming 'PAY ATTENTION TO ME DAMN IT '. But its also okay to move along faster than that, but making sure that you atleast understand the basics of not only the deity but the culture they come from is SO important |
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Jace
Newbie
finding nonbinary S.O. names is dreadfully difficult.
Posts: 43
Pronouns: They/them
Religion: Gaelic Polytheist
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Post by Jace on Jan 27, 2015 17:35:13 GMT -6
As stated above, literally the main thing a lot of people view about eclecticism and venerating deities from multiple religions is taking the time to learn how each religion worships or honors a deity. Not only does it show respect to others within the religion, it shows that there's another level of dedication in the respect for that god. How things develop afterwards, based on UPG, personal preference, and god-canon is a totally different story. But for starting out, I'd definitely say take some time to 1. Research the gods in question even more just to cover all of the bases, 2. Ask people who already worship or venerate them the methods they use and ways they do it so you can get a feel of modern practices for those deities, and 3. Follow your gut instinct in this situation, because for many religious practices are about having a sort of safe place and a bit of a comfort zone, so it really is all about how you feel and how you want to proceed.
As for Celtic deities being stern, I should probably stop joking that Medb is a squirrel goddess who is going to send the weird grey/red hybrid squirrels after me and should stop calling the Cailleach "the Hag" and then immediately giggling afterwards because I imagine this disgusting, raggedy, hunchbacked monstrosity of a witch.
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Post by saintfelicity on Jan 27, 2015 18:03:45 GMT -6
Quick relevant sidebar: the Celtic pantheons are all quite different from each other - you have your Gaelic, Brythonic, and Gaulish. I can't speak much to Brythonic and Gaulish although I believe it's similar, but pantheon is also kind of not-as-applicable-ish-sorta (WHOOO ACADEMIC EXACTITUDE) as a term for the Gaelic deities, a lot of that having to do with the fact that they're beings that weren't necessarily here before all of us, but another group of beings that have conquered Ireland in the span of history. A common way to refer to the beings Gaelic polytheists honor is "na Dé ocus Andé" which in Irish literally means "the Gods and Ungods," since Gaelic practice generally pulls in ancestors and spirits (such as the Good Folk)
So anyway that said, there's definitely some stern deities, and some definitely... not stern ones. I'm um, thinking specifically of the Dagda in Cath Mag Tuiredh after downing the Fomorii's porridge, walking around with his stomach distended and his penis hanging out. VERY ATTRACTIVE.
Again, can't speak for Brythonic and Gaulish here, but I think Gaelic deities can be reasonably compatible with other practices because of the casual-ish relationship involved. Part of honoring them comes from contractual obligation from our ancestors who conquered Ireland from the Tuatha Dé Danann, who agreed to give offerings in exchange for the Dé ensuring good harvests and so on. Basically, they don't have to be placed above other deities. So in tandem with learning about the religious traditions of the deities you're interested in honoring, also be sure to learn what those deities' strictures are.
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Chev
Junior Member
Struggling to learn and grow.
Posts: 97
Pronouns: She/Her
Religion: Oh, ain't that the question
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Post by Chev on Jan 29, 2015 18:39:41 GMT -6
It's really great to hear that all's well as long as it's okay.
I just had a small epiphany that makes me so happy I kinda want to cry and I'm kinda sad I didn't think about him when I made this post.
.. Is the Monkey King actually on the Chinese pantheon? Or would he be considered more of a pop culture deity? I've got a kind of... spitfire fondness for the Monkey King that he just makes me so happy that it almost makes me cry, especially when I watch any movie that has him in it. (... Or it's that I'm more depressed than I realize and his freedom and happiness is something I actually crave. I'm really not sure now...) I know he's kind of chaotic but it seems like he's the embodiment of freedom and carefreeness.
I've tried doing some research on him, but most that comes up is torn between Smite/League and movies, depending on if you're looking for Sun Wukong or "monkey king". The only definitive I've found is that he's first in a book, but other sites say he's on the pantheon roster?
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Post by Mivi on Jan 29, 2015 21:39:52 GMT -6
It's really great to hear that all's well as long as it's okay. I just had a small epiphany that makes me so happy I kinda want to cry and I'm kinda sad I didn't think about him when I made this post. .. Is the Monkey King actually on the Chinese pantheon? Or would he be considered more of a pop culture deity? I've got a kind of... spitfire fondness for the Monkey King that he just makes me so happy that it almost makes me cry, especially when I watch any movie that has him in it. (... Or it's that I'm more depressed than I realize and his freedom and happiness is something I actually crave. I'm really not sure now...) I know he's kind of chaotic but it seems like he's the embodiment of freedom and carefreeness. I've tried doing some research on him, but most that comes up is torn between Smite/League and movies, depending on if you're looking for Sun Wukong or "monkey king". The only definitive I've found is that he's first in a book, but other sites say he's on the pantheon roster? The monkey king is a legitimate spirit found in Chinese folklore. I'm on my phone at work so I will try to dig up sources for you after. |
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Chev
Junior Member
Struggling to learn and grow.
Posts: 97
Pronouns: She/Her
Religion: Oh, ain't that the question
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Post by Chev on Jan 30, 2015 0:12:04 GMT -6
Ah, thank you Mivi! He seems to be rather difficult to hunt for with recent media.
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Post by Mivi on Jan 30, 2015 0:44:11 GMT -6
Not a problem! I asked my ethnically Chinese friend about him and this is what she had to say:
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Chev
Junior Member
Struggling to learn and grow.
Posts: 97
Pronouns: She/Her
Religion: Oh, ain't that the question
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Post by Chev on Jan 30, 2015 11:25:10 GMT -6
Aaa, thank you! It's hard to find things on him that definitively put him in the pantheon that isn't gaming- or movie-related.
... And now, thinking back to a tarot spread someone pulled/interpreted for me.. I am slightly confused. The basic gist of it (it was a deity communication spread focused on who likes me, essentially) was that the individual was all about just doing it and they seemed to say to grow up (partially due to immaturity and "I don't wannaaaaa") and you'll grow yourself. Basically be an adult, stop being childish and start taking initiative, and good things will come. Augh, I'm not sure where I put that interpretation, I can't remember any of the cards...
Anyway, thanks again for asking your friend! At least I know that future hunting will eventually lead me to information!
(Now I have potentially three/four shrines I should consider... Got a new question for my other thread xD)
Edit: Is there a generally preferred way to refer to him? Or can Monkey (King), Wukong, Sun Wukong (and other names) be used interchangeably? I don't think he'd mind, but I'm not really sure.
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Post by Mivi on Jan 30, 2015 15:24:36 GMT -6
I thiiink Wukong is fine, I don't recall what the possible respectable term would be (since he is a 'King'). But also be aware that if you're not ethnically Chinese, that may be a "do not enter".
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Chev
Junior Member
Struggling to learn and grow.
Posts: 97
Pronouns: She/Her
Religion: Oh, ain't that the question
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Post by Chev on Feb 7, 2015 16:38:38 GMT -6
I'm not Chinese in any form. That's where a lot of my concern has come from =\
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Post by Jess on Mar 21, 2015 16:00:56 GMT -6
[...], can't speak for Brythonic and Gaulish here, but I think Gaelic deities can be reasonably compatible with other practices because of the casual-ish relationship involved. Part of honoring them comes from contractual obligation from our ancestors who conquered Ireland from the Tuatha Dé Danann, who agreed to give offerings in exchange for the Dé ensuring good harvests and so on. Basically, they don't have to be placed above other deities. So in tandem with learning about the religious traditions of the deities you're interested in honoring, also be sure to learn what those deities' strictures are. *SWOOPS IN TWO MONTHS LATE* Can't speak to Brythonic, but Gaulish deities/entities are generally compatible with other gods and spirits. Because of the Gallic diaspora being spread all hither and yon (northern continental Europe, the Alps, the Mediterranean, and so forth), the culture/practices are generally integrated with a variety of other cultures, e.g. Germanic, at those locations. That's not even mentioning Rome--the Roman integration with Gaulish faith went both ways, as the Romans inducted, for example, Epona into their own religion, and Roman gods are attested in Gaul, which suggests that the Gauls were not picky about the whole thing. |
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