boywonder
Newbie
Posts: 14
Pronouns: They/Theirs
Religion: Questioning/UU
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Post by boywonder on Feb 21, 2015 21:16:50 GMT -6
Hi. You can call me TJ (pronouns they/theirs, though he/his are also acceptable), and I'm...actually not sure about spirituality at all. I've been a really bitter atheist for a lot of years, actually, and I'm just now sort of coming out of that phase. I was raised in a Wiccan tradition, though that's not really for me currently. I don't know what is for me currently. I know that I don't buy into monotheism at all, and I've had some...Reasons that I feel like I should go back into spirituality with different gods now that I'm older. I'm not sure how to explain it well, which is the primary reason I joined this board, I guess. Right now, on the very small barren altar I have, I have representations for Bastet and Hathor, as well as two others I'm not sure I want to talk about just yet. My other hobbies are music, theatre, reading, comics, cosplay, general geek stuff. I have no idea how to do introductions, honestly, I promise I'm very friendly.
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veritywhitethorn
Junior Member
Posts: 60
Pronouns: She/her
Religion: Celtic polytheist
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Hello!
Feb 22, 2015 1:15:14 GMT -6
Post by veritywhitethorn on Feb 22, 2015 1:15:14 GMT -6
*waves* hello!
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Hello!
Feb 22, 2015 3:23:59 GMT -6
Post by Allec on Feb 22, 2015 3:23:59 GMT -6
Welcome to the board! Be curious and ask as many questions as you want What comics do you read?
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boywonder
Newbie
Posts: 14
Pronouns: They/Theirs
Religion: Questioning/UU
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Post by boywonder on Feb 22, 2015 13:16:28 GMT -6
veritywhitethorn hi! Allec thank you! I primarily read Marvel right now. I used to be a huge DC fan until they rebooted and destroyed everything I loved about it. Right now I follow Daredevil, Agent of Asgard, Black Widow, and Winter Soldier closely but I read others too. c:
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Hello!
Feb 22, 2015 14:22:48 GMT -6
Post by Allec on Feb 22, 2015 14:22:48 GMT -6
I'm having the same problem with DC right now :/ Ugh.
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boywonder
Newbie
Posts: 14
Pronouns: They/Theirs
Religion: Questioning/UU
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Hello!
Feb 23, 2015 10:20:28 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by boywonder on Feb 23, 2015 10:20:28 GMT -6
I'm having the same problem with DC right now :/ Ugh. Ugh I'm sorry. It's been years since I read anything they did. I'm actually scared Marvel is about to do the same crap with Secret Wars. Maybe they'll prove me wrong. :/
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Hello!
Feb 24, 2015 21:40:09 GMT -6
Post by saintfelicity on Feb 24, 2015 21:40:09 GMT -6
Welcome to the forum TJ! I was an atheist for a few years before digging back in to spirituality about two or so years ago, so I'd definitely be happy to chat. I think we can incorporate some of that in the Recovering Monotheists board, if you want to check that out.
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boywonder
Newbie
Posts: 14
Pronouns: They/Theirs
Religion: Questioning/UU
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Hello!
Feb 25, 2015 23:16:37 GMT -6
Post by boywonder on Feb 25, 2015 23:16:37 GMT -6
Welcome to the forum TJ! I was an atheist for a few years before digging back in to spirituality about two or so years ago, so I'd definitely be happy to chat. I think we can incorporate some of that in the Recovering Monotheists board, if you want to check that out. I've been an atheist like my entire adult life tbh. Also I feel like the way I navigate spirituality is very weird and is also...idk, unorthodox and wouldn't be welcome in most places so I've been super quiet about it. /tiptoes into forum I'll go check that board out, thank you!
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Hello!
Feb 25, 2015 23:24:27 GMT -6
Post by Allec on Feb 25, 2015 23:24:27 GMT -6
Well, there really isn't an "orthodox" way to approach spirituality. I think it's one of those messy endeavors that takes different routes for many people. Unless you're being rude to how other people believe, I can't imagine what approach would be wrong. (Even approaching deities as "You're not real" is valid in my opinion. Skepticism isn't a shameful thing.)
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boywonder
Newbie
Posts: 14
Pronouns: They/Theirs
Religion: Questioning/UU
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Post by boywonder on Feb 26, 2015 9:48:41 GMT -6
Well, there really isn't an "orthodox" way to approach spirituality. I think it's one of those messy endeavors that takes different routes for many people. Unless you're being rude to how other people believe, I can't imagine what approach would be wrong. (Even approaching deities as "You're not real" is valid in my opinion. Skepticism isn't a shameful thing.) Thanks for the encouragement. I have a hard time sticking with concepts like "I want to work with x entire pantheon" because I literally cannot be bothered, and I have trouble with keeping traditions of any kind for...various reasons. But also two of the deities I'm drawn to are "fictional" (like from a so-called fictional world) and some people look down on that I guess, though why a work of fiction should count as different from myths and legends, I genuinely don't know! I also am like toeing a line where I'm interested in voodoo/vodou and I'm like...is this appropriation somehow... Personally I'd never look down on anyone for not believing in god/gods either. Despite my presence here and this kind of stuff I've been experiencing lately I'm not sure I believe any gods are real. I've also had some run ins with the pagan community where sometimes I'm like "please stop saying words at me" because it gets very weird and self-important in some circles? Not that I think it will here. Tl;dr sorry.
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aondeug
Full Member
Posts: 141
Pronouns: She/Her/Hers, He/Him/His
Religion: Thai Theravada, Irish polytheism
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Post by aondeug on Feb 26, 2015 12:27:45 GMT -6
Well, to some it's that the fictional worlds are just that. Fictional. Whereas the gods are as real as someone's grandparents. At least that is why I sometimes get cranky when people insist my gods are from fictional stories. My religion's very important to me. I might not have it figured out but it is very important to me and one of the few things that get me stubborn and standing up for myself.
You're fine though. Not grumpy at you or anything. I just want to point that out and make it clear.
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boywonder
Newbie
Posts: 14
Pronouns: They/Theirs
Religion: Questioning/UU
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Post by boywonder on Feb 26, 2015 13:40:19 GMT -6
I just have a hard time figuring out why gods from x recorded stories get to count as real and others don't. It's why I very rarely mention it at all but I figured here was a mostly ok place to do so. What makes my god more fictional than someone else's god? I don't know.
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aondeug
Full Member
Posts: 141
Pronouns: She/Her/Hers, He/Him/His
Religion: Thai Theravada, Irish polytheism
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Post by aondeug on Feb 26, 2015 14:38:12 GMT -6
Oh no it's fine to mention it. Was just trying to help explain why some take issue with it since you seem concerned and curious about this? I want to help.
In my case, at least personally, it's a matter of experience. Did I personally experience something that I could deem, however it is I am going to, was the presence of a god or a sign of the existence of one? Now we can say that the dream I had about Lugh and my moment during a thunder storm when I went to a mosque service are just, one, a dream and, two, me being mentally ill or something. But to me I feel that, yes, those were experiences that involved Lugh. They are evidence, to me, of his existence.
And if Lugh exists then why wouldn't, say, Brighid exist? It'd be possible that the Dagda and the MorrĂgan could be real too if he was.
So because of that experience I am placing my faith in the other Gaelic gods existing, Otherworld existing, the power of poetry and so on and so forth. And due to personal reasons I'm not just believing that these beings and such exist, but also that I feel that they are worth study and respect and being venerated.
My standards for all that being based in Buddhist practice and philosophy (my religious thing isn't sorted out. spent four years or so identifying as theravada buddhist). I found evidence of the thing being real. Then I found evidence of the thing being worth veneration and respect. Like, yes, we can say that the Buddha was Enlightened or whatever the fuck but why should WE as individuals even care? Who is he? What did he say? What if the Buddha was Enlightened but he was also a genocidal sexist pig? Would he be entitled veneration just because he's Enlightened? Maybe I guess because he has some sort of fancy status, but I'm sure as hell not going to respect genocidal sexist Buddha. Because that shit isn't cool. He wouldn't be getting my triple bows, that's for damn sure.
So I found evidence of Lugh being real and studied and what not. Then worked out that these other things may be real as well, and they are taken in faith even if I haven't experienced them personally. Then after reading stories and thinking on things and practicing decided that, yes, Lugh is more than deserving of respect. Far, far more than deserving. He's worth respect and love and awe and effort and much more.
This doesn't mean that I made him real or something or that his existence somehow hinges on whether or not that I saw him. Simply that I came to accept his reality after coming into contact with him.
Though I guess that leads to the question of "Ok so why did you consider he might be real, but not Nayru from Zelda?" There is, yes, there is a possibility that Nayru, Din, and Farore are real. I do, however, afford attested religious traditions (dead or living) more weight for the most part though. I don't particularly have any sort of reason as to why though, save that if I think about it I do actually enjoy conforming to some sort of authority and tradition. Which is silly, I suppose. Especially when I look at figures such as Son Wukong. Wukong, if I recall, started his existence as a character in a Chinese novel. He's since gone on to be a being who is venerated and people have shrines for him and the like.
And he started as something that we can define as "fictional".
So really who is to say that the Three Goddesses can't become an actual fucking thing and that the Zelda fans can't begin their faith? It's certainly not me.
That's all just specific to me though.
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boywonder
Newbie
Posts: 14
Pronouns: They/Theirs
Religion: Questioning/UU
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Post by boywonder on Feb 26, 2015 14:50:24 GMT -6
I'm approaching everything with serious skepticism overall because I...have an incredibly hard time believing in anything at all. That said, I personally don't have any more trouble believing in - to use your example - Nayru than I do in Jehovah or Lugh or Anubis. Maybe there's something to be said for tradition, but it would be nice to feel ok talking about something newer too.
Thank you for your take on it.
It's been literally a decade since I actually talked about gods in general so I'm not very good at it >>
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aondeug
Full Member
Posts: 141
Pronouns: She/Her/Hers, He/Him/His
Religion: Thai Theravada, Irish polytheism
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Hello!
Feb 26, 2015 15:19:43 GMT -6
Post by aondeug on Feb 26, 2015 15:19:43 GMT -6
Sure thing! I like talking about religion and what not a lot, and trying to help out what I can with it. It's very important to me like I said. And it's fine. Believe me, you're doing just fine.
And yeah I can see how some would be interested in new things more. Like I said I just have a bias for tradition. Oh Shakyamuni how you tried to break me of that habit and how I failed you.
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