Post by Intaier on Apr 7, 2017 15:15:37 GMT -6
… I may better believe that random internet person would lie about their “godphone conversation” or other interaction with God, than that a God will lie.
Lying, normally, is not what the Gods will do.
They can, indeed, word things in a tricksters’ way…
Sometimes we may not get the FULL picture, but only what we need to know right now.
[There are gods in other pantheons who don’t mind lying and cheating more intense than the Netjeru; but let’s talk about the Netjeru]
(** additions from other polytheists welcome: I'm writing from kemetic perspective before all)
The Netjeru have no reason to lie to people. Especially to people who are their followers and worshippers, who respect Them and honor Them and are Their friends.
The conversations between Gods themselves, recorded in the myths… well, these are MYTHS.
In the myths, Netjeru used tricks to achieve their goals;
Such as Aset getting to the courtplace on the island, tricking the boatman Anti, then tricking Set to make him proclaim Heru as Heir of the throne.
But this is Mythology, and it took place in Mythical Times, and who knows with which level of metaphor we should perceive all the myths nowadays?
The Myths we have about Netjeru, are human tales about the Gods and not sacrted scripture.
So generally… Can a Netjer lie to a human?
Technically yes, they can. But not exactly telling lies, more likely using trickstery and cheat words if they really need to achieve something GREATLY important.
Even in the mythical times - the Netjeru were not running around lying to people every day.
If we will take the myths of Aset/Isis, we will see that she can tell people not the full truth, and trick them, to achieve something important.
Such as she tricks Anti-boatman to take her to the island where the court is gathering; because it’s IMPORTANT for the whole Universe to finish her agenda of Making Heru the King.
And also she tricks Set, using the world-play.
Also when she goes looking for Osiris’ body, and enters the King’s palace temporarily for babysitting :) she doesn’t tell them she is Goddess. But not saying full truth about who you are is not lying.
We can look through the myths and see the behavior of Netjeru.
Babi accuses Djehuty in stealing the offerings; does he tell a lie? By studying this myth carefully, we may come to conclusion that if we take in consideration Khonsu-Djehuty syncretic form, then Babi is not lying, just not knowing/not telling the full truth.
Again, this is not about Netjeru dealing with PEOPLE, this is between the Gods, and so it’s harder for us to judge.
What Set was doing in Osyrian myth cycle, again, was important for the whole Universe and cosmic balance, as part of the transformation of Osiris.
What They did, had to be done; and we are living not in mythical times.
Gods don’t spend their time all day with us on Earth.
And many of the myths are still myths. We don’t have to see them all as something that happened literally.
So, to sum things up, we can find examples of the Netjeru mostly using trickstery, cheat, taking one other’ guises in mythology.
But not like they do it all the time. Every thing like this is an exception from “we all live on Maat” rule and is done for greater good.
Aset cheats with Anti and Set, but it’s Important to make Heru a King.
So, the chance that the God will LIE to human devotee is really very small, at least with kemetic pantheon.
And even if they will say something that would turn out not to be truth, there are chances of:
godphone jamming,
divination going wrong,
plain misunderstanding,
Gods tricking you into doing something for the purpose of some greater good that you will realize later.
Also Gods may just play harmless pranks. For fun. They do.
Their agendas are so big that we simply can’t comprehend the WHOLE picture.
About God theoretically telling to a huge wrongdoer “What you are doing is ok”…
– there is a big chance of:
dealing with impostor entity/spirit,
person making things up,
person dealing with their own thoughtform,
person misinterpreting the message of the God, etc.
Because we would like to hear good things. And receive approval from Gods.
Also the godphoning itself is a thing that is complicated.
Impostors happen. Wishful thinking happens.
Just plain dealing with imaginary friend instead of God may happen.
And so my opinion is, the Netjeru must have Very Serious Reason to tell a human something that would qualify as a lie.
And even then, human interpreting is as a LIE may be wrong.
Trickstery is not always lying.
Just like the kids scream “abuse” when God doesn’t give them candy,
then they may scream “Lie!” when a God simply made a prank.
Also, theoretically, God may lie to a devotee with really serious reason: for example, to save them from something really bad happening, from the chance of devotee being seriously hurt, etc.
And so, summarizing the things up (This is my opinion, remember):
- there is a possibility the God may lie to a person.
- but the chances that a Netjer would intentionally lie to a devotee, are really small.
Our relationships with the Netjeru should have foundation of respect, faith, trust, devotion, love;
Gods are not predators looking for our energy and our offerings.
They are our Friends, Parents, Brothers, Teachers, Mentors, Guides.
And before all, They Are Gods;
Gods, worthy-of-worship.
* all points expressed above are my private opinion
Lying, normally, is not what the Gods will do.
They can, indeed, word things in a tricksters’ way…
Sometimes we may not get the FULL picture, but only what we need to know right now.
[There are gods in other pantheons who don’t mind lying and cheating more intense than the Netjeru; but let’s talk about the Netjeru]
(** additions from other polytheists welcome: I'm writing from kemetic perspective before all)
The Netjeru have no reason to lie to people. Especially to people who are their followers and worshippers, who respect Them and honor Them and are Their friends.
The conversations between Gods themselves, recorded in the myths… well, these are MYTHS.
In the myths, Netjeru used tricks to achieve their goals;
Such as Aset getting to the courtplace on the island, tricking the boatman Anti, then tricking Set to make him proclaim Heru as Heir of the throne.
But this is Mythology, and it took place in Mythical Times, and who knows with which level of metaphor we should perceive all the myths nowadays?
The Myths we have about Netjeru, are human tales about the Gods and not sacrted scripture.
So generally… Can a Netjer lie to a human?
Technically yes, they can. But not exactly telling lies, more likely using trickstery and cheat words if they really need to achieve something GREATLY important.
Even in the mythical times - the Netjeru were not running around lying to people every day.
If we will take the myths of Aset/Isis, we will see that she can tell people not the full truth, and trick them, to achieve something important.
Such as she tricks Anti-boatman to take her to the island where the court is gathering; because it’s IMPORTANT for the whole Universe to finish her agenda of Making Heru the King.
And also she tricks Set, using the world-play.
Also when she goes looking for Osiris’ body, and enters the King’s palace temporarily for babysitting :) she doesn’t tell them she is Goddess. But not saying full truth about who you are is not lying.
We can look through the myths and see the behavior of Netjeru.
Babi accuses Djehuty in stealing the offerings; does he tell a lie? By studying this myth carefully, we may come to conclusion that if we take in consideration Khonsu-Djehuty syncretic form, then Babi is not lying, just not knowing/not telling the full truth.
Again, this is not about Netjeru dealing with PEOPLE, this is between the Gods, and so it’s harder for us to judge.
What Set was doing in Osyrian myth cycle, again, was important for the whole Universe and cosmic balance, as part of the transformation of Osiris.
What They did, had to be done; and we are living not in mythical times.
Gods don’t spend their time all day with us on Earth.
And many of the myths are still myths. We don’t have to see them all as something that happened literally.
So, to sum things up, we can find examples of the Netjeru mostly using trickstery, cheat, taking one other’ guises in mythology.
But not like they do it all the time. Every thing like this is an exception from “we all live on Maat” rule and is done for greater good.
Aset cheats with Anti and Set, but it’s Important to make Heru a King.
So, the chance that the God will LIE to human devotee is really very small, at least with kemetic pantheon.
And even if they will say something that would turn out not to be truth, there are chances of:
godphone jamming,
divination going wrong,
plain misunderstanding,
Gods tricking you into doing something for the purpose of some greater good that you will realize later.
Also Gods may just play harmless pranks. For fun. They do.
Their agendas are so big that we simply can’t comprehend the WHOLE picture.
About God theoretically telling to a huge wrongdoer “What you are doing is ok”…
– there is a big chance of:
dealing with impostor entity/spirit,
person making things up,
person dealing with their own thoughtform,
person misinterpreting the message of the God, etc.
Because we would like to hear good things. And receive approval from Gods.
Also the godphoning itself is a thing that is complicated.
Impostors happen. Wishful thinking happens.
Just plain dealing with imaginary friend instead of God may happen.
And so my opinion is, the Netjeru must have Very Serious Reason to tell a human something that would qualify as a lie.
And even then, human interpreting is as a LIE may be wrong.
Trickstery is not always lying.
Just like the kids scream “abuse” when God doesn’t give them candy,
then they may scream “Lie!” when a God simply made a prank.
Also, theoretically, God may lie to a devotee with really serious reason: for example, to save them from something really bad happening, from the chance of devotee being seriously hurt, etc.
And so, summarizing the things up (This is my opinion, remember):
- there is a possibility the God may lie to a person.
- but the chances that a Netjer would intentionally lie to a devotee, are really small.
Our relationships with the Netjeru should have foundation of respect, faith, trust, devotion, love;
Gods are not predators looking for our energy and our offerings.
They are our Friends, Parents, Brothers, Teachers, Mentors, Guides.
And before all, They Are Gods;
Gods, worthy-of-worship.
* all points expressed above are my private opinion